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Alyson wrote:

Tonberry3001 wrote:

AMAZING film...Absolutely blew me away. As for a sequel, do you think there is any chance of Nolan making a movie version of the Dark Knight Returns? They would have to take out the chapter on Two Face and possibly the one on the Joker as well, but I would love to see his treatment on it. Obviously it would need changes, but just seeing the fight with Superman at the end of the movie would be epic.

Nolan and Miller - that would be ridiculously awesome I am thinking. But I think it would be a difficult movie to make and market.

First of all that movie wouldn't be nearly as good because Frank Miller would want to direct it, and in my opinion, would ruin it. Secondly their styles are way to different to gel in any way shape or form. So I highly doubt you will ever see that from Nolan.

I really disagree about the boats being rigged with their own detonation. There is nothing in the film that indicates that. If there was, I missed it. I think you are looking for something that isn't there. Joker did it to test society, to see how far he could push civilians. To see if they would, if faced with the decision to kill or potentially be killed, would they take those lives. If it had blown up themselves, it would have been like the Joker would be punishing them for doing what he wanted. For being like him. I really don't think this would be the case. He is so sick, that he would have found joy in watching one boat blow up the other. I really think that this is what the Joker was going for. It would have almost been a noble act if it had blown up their own boat, as it would have killed the boat that more deserved to die. I can't possibly believe that the Joker would want that.

No, there wasn't anything in the movie the directly clued us into the detanators going to their own boats, its just a norm with the joker that there is always a twist or a "gotcha". Just like how he gave Batman the opposite addresses, knowing he would choose Rachel and not Harvey - punishing him for his choice as you say.

Red Raider you are my hero we pretty much exactly have the same thoughts on the movie. Thank you this is pretty much what ive been one of dipshit friends for the past 2 days. Agree you 100% on this great movie but not a mind blowing masterpiece and defintley not the best movie of all time.

JackO wrote:

I don't think Nolan should make another one. I don't want Spiderman 3 here. His work is complete. Let someone else pick up the reigns he left behind because I highly doubt that anything, not even Philip Seymour Hoffman as the Penguin, can top this one.

as much as i'd like to see another one from him thats true.

No, there wasn't anything in the movie the directly clued us into the detanators going to their own boats, its just a norm with the joker that there is always a twist or a "gotcha". Just like how he gave Batman the opposite addresses, knowing he would choose Rachel and not Harvey - punishing him for his choice as you say.

Again, I disagree. To us, the people watching the film,this was a twist. This was all a part of Joker's broad plan. He knew that Batman would go after Rachel, but she was supposed to die for the Joker. That's why he gave them opposite addresses. He needed Dent alive and Rachel dead so he could corrupt Harvey Dent and turn him into the madman of 2-Face, instead of being "Gotham's White Knight." He wasn't punishing Batman for choosing Rachel instead of Harvey. He was making sure that he would get both of them pissed off and crazy enough to commit more chaos. Of course, it only worked in Dent's case. Batman didn't break, even after his true love was killed.

numbersix_99 wrote:

Frisky, why did you prefer Batman Begins? For me, that was a half decent idea riddled by absurdities which would only make sense if the film portrayed its characters with a similar manner (seriously, this "genius" guardian of hyper-capitalism and corruption decided to bring down a city by filling the water supply with a crazy-gas and then stealing a bomb that turns water into steam?? Talk about beating around the bush...).

Yeah, just watched Begins again the other day. I too found this quite laughable.

Just because there is a picture of HARVEY DENT in the background, DOES NOT MEAN HE IS LITERALLY DEAD.

Harvey was the White Knight of Gotham , he was the becaon of hope for Gotham's citizens.

After being scarred like this, how can he even come out to the public again? So they say he is dead. That's my reasoning for it.

Trust me, Two-Face ain't dead, The Nolans wouldn't out him in a half-assed way like this by falling off a building.

Tuan (welcome back, btw), I am certain Two-Face is dead. For one thing, his character arc was completed, so there'd be no development for him in another movie except to act as a bad guy doing bad stuff. I'd like to think the Nolan's are sophisticated enough to realise this.

If the wanted the idea of Two-Face to be around for the next film, they would have made his "end" more ambiguous. Okay, the press conference didn't show a coffin, but after the fall you see him on the ground with his eyes open- which for the most part only happens when you're dead.

Sure, you can pick holes to open the possibility of him coming back, but the odds are against you.

Maybe that is the case. Because rumour has it that the DVD release will also be a 3-hour director's cut with more Two-Face scenes.

But I hope he does come back, because I can't see the next Batman film with a villain as great as The Joker or Two-Face. The Joker also hinted at his plan to corrupt Gotham by corrupting their beacon of hope for the city, Harvey Dent. So it would be awesome if that arc is actually fully realized.

I mean, what villains are there left apart from the lame ones like Mr. Freeze and stuff? Rumour has it Anthony Michael Hall will turn into The Riddler in the next one. That'd be great.

But my hope is they introduce Poison Ivy and Catwoman, so Batman can have a hot and steamy threesome with them.

Saw TDK last night at 10:50pm:

It was crazy bananas awesomeness!

I know that the greatness of movies is being discussed all over the place in here. My main question is: How can you tell a movie is the greatest movie of all time? Do you compare it to ones before or to other ones that fall short of that?

TDK has a quality and feeling of an epic movie.

-Lots of characters that have their story move forward. Not only do we see Bruce Wayne/Batman fall from grace, but Harvey Dent, Commissioner Gordon, and even The Joker

-A nice balance of comedy and drama. I loved how the Joker's comedy comes from the situations he's in. And the last 45 of the movie where Harvey goes to the dark side is also a great dramatic touch

-I forget that these people are actors. A lot of times during movies, I tell myself "oh that's (actors name), not (character name)". I didn't do that once.

-I genuinely care about the characters. When Bruce was sitting in his chair, dressed in the Batman suit upset, I was upset. When Harvey Dent went to the dark side, I gave a crap. And holy cow, when I thought Gordon was dead, I was saying "no, no, no!"

-Rewatchability. Hells yeah, I will be seeing this a few more times.

Also, there were times when I forgot that Bruce Wayne was Batman and vice versa.

I think that movies, when they are as good as this, will have a backlash. It's not because they think it sucks, its because they can't believe it's that good and that it still can be done in this day and age.

Very well said lilly. I agree with everything you said. When Batman saved the kid at the end, I actually fist pumped. And that was for a small character.

Finally saw the movie and as expected I loved it. Indeed the Joker Pencil trick was one of the greatest scenes ever filmed on celluloid. I rank it up there with Pulp Fiction's "I just shot Marvin in the face" and Office Space's "Copy Machine Killers" scene. Brilliant.

The opening bank heist was great and exactly the opening intro the Joker needed. It was evil, twisted and genius. The boats not killing each other was perfect and was a small spark of hope in the grim world. Joker lost that round so he tries again with the clown masked hostages. "If you won't choose to kill innocent victims, I will trick you into doing it."

Aly:

One thing that really bothered me though: the mayor's eyeliner

That annoyed me as well in the close up scene between him and Gordon.
I will add one more thing that bothered me. The Bat Pod could not turn with those squared off tires. Motorcycle tires are rounded to allow you to lean and reduce the radius of the tires thus making you turn. This would not be possible with those tires. They looked very cool but physically not possible. Only motorcyclists would catch that one though.

Banks:

Did anyone else have a problem with Batman having sonar? I know it's entirely possible, and real bats actually do have sonar, but I thought it was a reach.

The sonar was well done. This is fucking Batman you know?!?! If the Sonar showed up in NYPD Blue it would be far fetched but this is a billionaire dressing up in a black bat costume and fighting ninjas and knife weilding clowns... What part of that scenario makes sonar far fetched?

RedR and Becs:

it was clear the Joker had told him the opposite locations

I disagree. I think the Joker told him the true locations. The test (much like the boat test) was to see if Batman would do the right thing and save Harvey Dent to help in the battle against crime or save Rachel for selfish reasons. Batman saved Harvey Dent because it would do the most good for the city. Batman's plan backfires when Dent snaps and becomes Two Face. (Of course I could be wrong, I will have to watch again and keep track of the addresses more closely)

Whoever decided to blow up the other ferry would have actually blown up themselves. That's what the Joker would have done just for the fun of it.

I don't think you are correct here either. I thought so while watching the movie but in hind sight that isn't the Joker's MO. He would want the surviving boat to live with the fact that they killed people. The same thing with the Clown Masked Hostages. He wanted the police to kill innocent victims and then have to live with that fact. He is all about making people choose chaos or get forced into becoming monsters. That was the whole theme of the movie.

And with the other argument, Harvey Dent is dead, but Two Face lived. That is my thought. The press conference was to tell people that Harvey Dent died so they would not lose hope when they see him become a monster.

Donte77 wrote:

Finally saw the movie and as expected I loved it. Indeed the Joker Pencil trick was one of the greatest scenes ever filmed on celluloid. I rank it up there with Pulp Fiction's "I just shot Marvin in the face" and Office Space's "Copy Machine Killers" scene. Brilliant.

The opening bank heist was great and exactly the opening intro the Joker needed. It was evil, twisted and genius. The boats not killing each other was perfect and was a small spark of hope in the grim world. Joker lost that round so he tries again with the clown masked hostages. "If you won't choose to kill innocent victims, I will trick you into doing it."

And with the other argument, Harvey Dent is dead, but Two Face lived. That is my thought. The press conference was to tell people that Harvey Dent died so they would not lose hope when they see him become a monster.

Yay! Thanks for understanding what I was trying to get at. I think the giveaway to that was the big ole picture of the old Harvey Dent at the press conference, rather then the picture being a reflection of what he is now. I guess we shall see when the video game and DVD comes out.

No Donte, the Joker definitely told Batman opposite locations. I just saw it again today. Batman tells Gordon he is going after Rachel and then Gordon calls all of his men to the location that the Joker said that Dent was located at. Since the cops show up at Rachel's location, which was where Joker had told Batman Dent was, you know that he told them opposite locations.

Also, if you can live with Sonar, you can live with the tires I'd hope. I'm also leaning towards Two-Face coming back. I mean they killed Gordon in this one and brought him back. Why not wait til the next movie and shock the world with his return. But there will need to be a counterpart to set this up. And about his eyes being open, only one was, because his eyelid was burned off. The other one is closed.

geezer9687 wrote:

And about his eyes being open, only one was, because his eyelid was burned off. The other one is closed.

I was almost sure both eyes were open. Oh well, thanks for clearing it up. I still can't see the Nolans bringing back Two-Face as his story was for the most part told.

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